[Politics] The long game

[Barnet Seagull]

I've been thinking a lot about the future recently and what it'll mean for the United Kingdom and the world on the back of opening up a new coal mine and de-regulating the banks and the overall narrative around what this means. I'm trying to avoid the sensationalist thinking and genuinely consider the long term prospects for our union.

How do we ensure our economy grows?

Put very simply, if we want to achieve a high standard of living, we need to be creating value that the rest of the world needs or wants.

It struck me that there isn't really a lot that we are world-leading in and there isn't really a lot of government support or protection for when we do generate valuable assets. These are usually sold off to overseas companies e.g. ARM to the Japanese, McLaren to Bahrain to generate shareholder profits

This is a very short game and this doesn't seem to happen in other countries
Feels like something needs to change but I don't know what.

 

[zefarelly]

We're a pisspot Island trading off (questionable) past glories hanging by the thread of an ancient crumbling infrastructure we don't even own. We've sold all the family gold. . . We were doing very well as part of a band, but going solo is up there with Andrew Ridgelys post Wham pop career. THere is no long game, no one with any strings to pull considered it. I've no idea where it's going, we will probably end up as someones gimp.

 

[GT49er]

The crux of the problem was flogging off everything we owned, ultimately to overseas investors - our water, gas, electricity, railways, etc, etc, etc. Econmically, everything else pails into insignificance.

As far as the coal mine's concerned, although we'd all love to go totally green instantly that just isn't possible so we'll need some coal for a while yet - so might as well use our own rather than import it.

 

[el punal]

The crux of the problem was flogging off everything we owned, ultimately to overseas investors - our water, gas, electricity, railways, etc, etc, etc. Econmically, everything else pails into insignificance.

As far as the coal mine's concerned, although we'd all love to go totally green instantly that just isn't possible so we'll need some coal for a while yet - so might as well use our own rather than import it.

We used to have an open fire in the Punal household. Our local coal merchant commented that the only household coal he could obtain was Polish and was gash - he was right, nasty stuff. All in the past now as we’ve become environmentally friendly had bought an electric stove which looks like a wood burner with illuminated gubbins to make you feel warm and cosy!

 

[B-right-on]

As far as I'm concerned, deregulation of the banks is one of the primary causes of the 'boom and bust' short sighted activities.

Always look to the money.

2008 was due to the MBS fiasco due to banking greed following US Govt deregulation allowing really dodgy mortgages to be bundled with A rated mortgages and sold as A rated around the world. How many people were jailed for the criminality?

Banks are considered 'to big to fail' and so can, literally, do anything they want to, take every dodgy risk possible and gamble away billions knowing full well that they will always be bailed out.

Years ago Banks had to keep their deposit accounts and investment accounts totally separate. In the mid 80s this was relaxed and in the end of the 90s pretty much got rid of. As well as the lessening of the fractional reserves gives them even more money to gamble away. Whilst paying millions in bonuses which never need to be paid back.

Until the banking system is overhauled and regulated tighter than a ducks arse, we'll still have these booms and busts and a toothless ineffective Govt no matter who is in power.

Look to see who pulls the strings? Follow the money.

 

[portlock seagull]

Hard to compete with any countries able to employ people as near slaves, without any employment or civil rights, lower living standards, where life is cheap and people are happy enough to put up with because they know no difference. Ow, and there are hundreds of millions of even less fortunate people willing to take their place.

Why else do you think your clothes and electricals cost a fraction of what they used to and are now deemed disposables?

 

[rogersix]

The crux of the problem was flogging off everything we owned, ultimately to overseas investors - our water, gas, electricity, railways, etc, etc, etc. Econmically, everything else pails into insignificance.

As far as the coal mine's concerned, although we'd all love to go totally green instantly that just isn't possible so we'll need some coal for a while yet - so might as well use our own rather than import it.

80% of the coal is actually destined for export as the sulphur content is too high,

so giving planning permission for this mine would be extremely foolhardy

 

[chickens]

The Conservative Party has, since 1979, been the party of selling off our utilities and state run industries, and there comes a time where, like a faded aristocrat selling off the good furniture, there’s not a lot left that people are going to want to bid for without huge incentives (yet further transference of taxpayer funds to private organisations)

There’s a global shift to green technology, renewables etc. and we could and should have been front and centre of that, building expertise we could take around the world. Instead we have a government fighting tooth and nail to prop up the fossil fuel industry and slow our inevitable shift to new technologies. It’s disgusting.

 

[Blue3]

We are f#@%@£d as a nation our institutions are all broken and it’s people have no consensus what to do about it

I really believe that capitalism Is dying and our inability to make changes to adapt, the economic situation is beyond our government's ability’s and it’s weakness has given totalitarian states the green light to flex their muscles

 

[nicko31]

Until we get PR nothing will change, the Tory and Labour turkeys won't vote for Christmas.

Get a hung parliament, get the LD's in a as coalition partner with Labour and we could be in business

 

[Harry Wilson's tackle]

The crux of the problem was flogging off everything we owned, ultimately to overseas investors - our water, gas, electricity, railways, etc, etc, etc. Econmically, everything else pails into insignificance.

As far as the coal mine's concerned, although we'd all love to go totally green instantly that just isn't possible so we'll need some coal for a while yet - so might as well use our own rather than import it.

This, the chance to Tell Sid, the chance to make a fast buck, was what propelled Thatcher into her second and third terms. And the nation loved it. LOVED IT! If you weren't on board, you were a labour looser.

If there is a lesson to be learned from all this, then, well, I don't know? Hang on....

f*** the tories, springs to mind. Yes, that's the one. f*** THE TORIES. f*** them.

 

[Harry Wilson's tackle]

Until we get PR nothing will change, the Tory and Labour turkeys won't vote for Christmas.

Get a hung parliament, get the LD's in a as coalition partner with Labour and we could be in business

Let me get this right. You don't like the Tories or Labour?

So, you want to change the electoral system so that the Liberals can be king maker?

And you imagine that, unlike last time, the Liberals won't seize the first opportunity to go into coalition with the f***ing Tories again?

Good luck with that genius plan.



Labour will probably win by FPTP next time, because governments lose elections, and this present lot have looser written all over them. I'm not prepared to advocate to change the system so that Labour can be in thrall to a bunch of dope-smoking student wankers, just in case Labour doesn't win an overall majority. Sorry, no, I'm bloody not. Not at all. Death or glory.

 

[Simster]

Let me get this right. You don't like the Tories or Labour?

So, you want to change the electoral system so that the Liberals can be king maker?

And you imagine that, unlike last time, the Liberals won't seize the first opportunity to go into coalition with the f***ing Tories again?

Good luck with that genius plan.



Labour will probably win by FPTP next time, because governments lose elections, and this present lot have looser written all over them. I'm not prepared to advocate to change the system so that Labour can be in thrall to a bunch of dope-smoking student wankers, just in case Labour doesn't win an overall majority. Sorry, no, I'm bloody not. Not at all. Death or glory.

But who says the Lib Dems would always be kingmaker under PR? In fact, even under FPTP you might find the SNP or a number of minor parties get to act as kingmaker. And THAT is democracy anyway.

The bottom line is that for all your "f*** the Tories" bullshit, you're happy for the status quo to continue where they get to make all the decisions for years on end based on winning 35% of the vote, because you're happy enough for Labour to take power for five years in 20.

Wake up. The Tories are backed by a right wing press that not only gets to choose the news agenda but also influences enough voters to continue in power with only a large (ish) minority.

 

[BadFish]

I've been thinking a lot about the future recently and what it'll mean for the United Kingdom and the world on the back of opening up a new coal mine and de-regulating the banks and the overall narrative around what this means. I'm trying to avoid the sensationalist thinking and genuinely consider the long term prospects for our union.

How do we ensure our economy grows?

Put very simply, if we want to achieve a high standard of living, we need to be creating value that the rest of the world needs or wants.

It struck me that there isn't really a lot that we are world-leading in and there isn't really a lot of government support or protection for when we do generate valuable assets. These are usually sold off to overseas companies e.g. ARM to the Japanese, McLaren to Bahrain to generate shareholder profits

This is a very short game and this doesn't seem to happen in other countries
Feels like something needs to change but I don't know what.

You could try a government that is more representative of its electorate.

You are world leading in sucking up to oligarchs and billionaires and selling them everything you own while asking for minimal taxes. Shirt termism and a skewed priorities list has bought you here.

You just need to stop believing the lie that anyone who offers you something different is 'unelectable'.

Not you individually of course but you as a nation.

 

[BadFish]

Hard to compete with any countries able to employ people as near slaves, without any employment or civil rights, lower living standards, where life is cheap and people are happy enough to put up with because they know no difference. Ow, and there are hundreds of millions of even less fortunate people willing to take their place.

Why else do you think your clothes and electricals cost a fraction of what they used to and are now deemed disposables?

With the cost of living so high, people don't have a choice in choosing the cheap imports from said countries. Improve this and give people the opportunity to choose fair trade and locally produced. Also stop calling people woke for making these choices. Then maybe local and homegrown industry would strengthen and the economy would improve.

Surely the rise of craft beer manufacturers has shown us that there is an appetite for locally made quality products even at a premium price. Maybe this is a business model worth encouraging and supporting in other areas.

 

[Winker]

I've been thinking a lot about the future recently and what it'll mean for the United Kingdom and the world on the back of opening up a new coal mine and de-regulating the banks and the overall narrative around what this means. I'm trying to avoid the sensationalist thinking and genuinely consider the long term prospects for our union.

How do we ensure our economy grows?

Put very simply, if we want to achieve a high standard of living, we need to be creating value that the rest of the world needs or wants.

It struck me that there isn't really a lot that we are world-leading in and there isn't really a lot of government support or protection for when we do generate valuable assets. These are usually sold off to overseas companies e.g. ARM to the Japanese, McLaren to Bahrain to generate shareholder profits

This is a very short game and this doesn't seem to happen in other countries
Feels like something needs to change but I don't know what.

The new coal mine will provide coking coal to our steel industry. Steel is a strategic industry which we cannot do without. It makes sense to dig our own coal for it than to import it from Russia, Argentina, Australia etc.

 

[portlock seagull]

With the cost of living so high, people don't have a choice in choosing the cheap imports from said countries. Improve this and give people the opportunity to choose fair trade and locally produced. Also stop calling people woke for making these choices. Then maybe local and homegrown industry would strengthen and the economy would improve.

Surely the rise of craft beer manufacturers has shown us that there is an appetite for locally made quality products even at a premium price. Maybe this is a business model worth encouraging and supporting in other areas.

Ideology not policy though. High swathe of rich and powerful people inbetween first have to overcome.

 

[beorhthelm]

good start to question "How do we ensure our economy grows?" is treat it as an economic question, not a political question. government should do no more than set a tone and framework for growth. instead we get superficial promises of growth which usually amount to spending more day to day expenses.

what we need is more investment, in business and industry that see a net return over medium term. not savings, actual returns. roads, airports, railways, power, housing, commerce, trade, manufacturing. unfortunatly no one wants anything built near them and dont want any commerce that will make someone richer, so we're f***ed because we stall and block avenues to growth.

 

[Sea Cider]

The new coal mine will provide coking coal to our steel industry. Steel is a strategic industry which we cannot do without. It makes sense to dig our own coal for it than to import it from Russia, Argentina, Australia etc.

“The UK steel industry has been clear that the coal from the West Cumbria mine has limited potential due to its high sulphur levels,” said Chris McDonald, chief executive of the Materials Processing Institute, which serves as the UK’s national centre for steel research.
“This, combined with the industry’s drive to decarbonise, means that by the time the mine opens, only one of the UK’s current four blast furnaces is likely to be able to use this coal, meaning that more than 90% of production will be exported."

 

[nicko31]

The new coal mine will provide coking coal to our steel industry. Steel is a strategic industry which we cannot do without. It makes sense to dig our own coal for it than to import it from Russia, Argentina, Australia etc.

Problem our steel industry doesn’t want this coking coal

Tories are all over the place, announcing a new coal mine whilst simultaneously unbanning solar and onshore wind, all in a week.

They’re clueless